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was just an idea this weekend to get peoples opinions/thoughts on a stock series to aircooled eliminators, so people like me cant whoop people like you only joking!, now seriously, thoughts on a stock series, max 1641 with standard carb, steel shell and stock floorpan in a heads up race. just trying to get more people into drag racing without the expense of big motors/boxes etc. if engines are limited to 1641 with standard carbs + rev limiting rotor arms theres not going to be many breakages so everyone has a chance at cheap fun motorsport without feeling under pressure/intimidated (not sure thats the right word? correct me otherwise ) by you big boys. trust me, its crap when one of you lot pass me at double the speed im going! i mentioned it to a few and the general view was its a good idea.

over to you ......

i'll put the idea forward to my local club and see if theres any intrest if you like rich, i know a couple of them like the thought of racing but either use their bug daily and dont want the hastle of a big motor, or dont think its worth taking it down the strip if its not gonna pass under 15 seconds. i think its a good idea tho!

not that im sick of seeing you win or owt!

steve

Sounds a good idea on paper but i dont think it works as a class quite as simply as it sounds, ie what is stock? no header exhausts only stock boxes? that would stop some people racing but then allowing an aftermarket exhaust gives an unfair advantage against a stock car etc?

I know this is not the same but the principal is, they have a class like that in the states for mustangs and the cars in the stock class run 12's and cost nearly as much to build as a normal 10 second racecar as they have such a tight set of rules and peoples desire to win comes out over the fun factor and cost gets into it and the faster/lighter car will win in a heads up class and without having minimum weights, tyre sizes etc and rules you cant enforce i cant see how you can get an entirley even, fair playing field. you can knock a fair bit ie a few seconds off a stock cars 0-60 time with 1200 box, (different final drive) smaller tyres etc to enhace acceleration.

I understand your point however i am just not sure how practical it would be bearing in mind bracket racing is essentially the cheapest form of drag racing. Only need to look and see some people can run 12's on 1776 motors with the right work and others not even manage to crack 15's due to a bit more know how? All it takes is a bit of thought and i am sure people would be getting more power/torque even with a stock carb than a stock motor makes that unless you make them strip it you cant prove? What do you do then?

Just my opinion however and anything to get racers numbers up can be no bad thing, especially as us big boys may inspire a few more to build racecars in the future, i just think someone will eventually build a car just to win it, i know it won't be me however so no worries there


PS. nice one on that final though matey, it was a super race but i kind of agree, its hard trying to judge distance to that sneaky yellow bug when your approaching at twice its speed! But as they say, its racing!

cheers guys, i can see your point dave which was the point of this thread, the chance for everyone to voice there opinions, whether it be positive or negative, or constructive comments.
another thought after reading daves post, maybe do something similar to pro + sportsman? e.g. ACE pro upto 14.00secs and ACE stock/sportsman 14.00secs and above? just to try and break it up a bit but ran as a bracket race? and this may encourage slower cars/daily drivers at the strip without being passed at 135mph

again, open to comments, suggestions blah blah blah

cheers
richie

i think that would probibly be more successfull than the heads up idea rich, like i said above i know people who probibly wouldnt think of joining cause they see the sort of speeds some of the top end cars run and would feel out of place running in the high teens! even tho tbh they would probiby have a good chance of walking away with a win!

and i think some of it comes down to people not understanding the rules! i think the vast majority of people think drag racing is just flooring it and the first car to the finish is the winner (hence needing a fast car to win) and most wont delve deep enough to find out that its actualy a level playing field where anyone can win if they drive well!

steve

i know what you mean steve, craig mentioned this at the weekend that we should maybe have a info board of some sort to stand in the pit area, breifly explaining bracket racing and how it works because as you say, a lot, if not majority of people think its a flat out race. however, i still think if we can get numbers up for next year there should be 2 classes 1 for the big fast boys and 1 for the home of champions sorry i mean slightly slower cars

richie

yeah a board in the pits would be a good idea, i know most people i talk to think its all basicaly heads up, their usualy quite shocked at how much thought has to go into a run in the eliminations too, dial ins, reaction times, breaking out, etc etc, it makes it a thinking mans game as much as a drivers one tbh!

steve

Yep, a board in the pits with a pic of Richie and his trophy as champion and a list of everyones ET's relative to there championship positions! Will either prove the bracket racing piont or just highlight that the fast guys are shit racers

My thoughts...
Stock series? personally no. For a start there's a fair bit difference between 'stock' motors
I can see people getting bored pretty quickly/wanting to improve times, as people like most get a bit of the bug, hence baffles taken out of exhausts, bigger/rejetted stock carbs, secret head porting...then maybe want to join in with the 'big boys' ahem

As for a 'pro' and 'sportsman' type brackets, well I guess it would be number dependant. We're only a small group and I think if we start splitting into different groups....well who knows what'll happen.

If Richies doing so well all I can see it doing is encouraging the owners of slower cars to join in??? Maybe we should go with the board to explain to the masses what we do

BTW-Can I race my T4 van if the Ghia beaks? I could in the 'drc

For me having thought about it for a few days i'm sort of moving away from the idea.
Dave made some valid points ....and i agree it could become ....er complicated

As for the board......well i did mean some sort of info......maybe a leaflet hand out at an event like mini's v beetles. we always get a good turnout for this event.....then they all bugger of home

Have you tried to explain the concept of bracket racing to anyone ...well i have and after four attempts i just want to hit them and tell em they are thick and should fuck off

Bracket racing IS designed to equalise the cars.....maybe we should accept that now and again a VERY slow car could ......i say could (cos it aint over yet ) win the title...........and at the end of the day the driver still has to hit the times.

cheers

craig

Yeah numbers is a big big factor also, bearing in mind we only had 7 cars last round anyway! What do you do if only 1 sportsman car turns up and 4 pro cars? You cant run the sportsman car in the pro class as it would effect championship points etc, if the sportsman car took championship contenders out in early rounds i cant see pro drivers being to happy or visa versa in the case of one pro and a few sportsman cars.

What do you then do, turn one car away as there is not enough for a field of cars? I remember when i started racing small fields i.e 2-3-and 4 cars and its crap to be fair regardless of speeds.

I think you need good regular numbers for each proposed bracket/class at all meetings before you could consider it as a viable option?

Iam not been funny towards anyone here,but what the fuck is wrong with the club the way it is?
Its about having a laugh with our cars and good friends,its getting to serious for me,turn up, race,have a few drinks and have a relaxing weekend,easy.

ok everyone, put ya guns away! it was just an idea! for me the club is fine as it is, im just thinking of ways to encourage other potential members who think they need a spare wad of cash, however as craig says i think a leaflet explaining ACE/bracket racing would solve this. i can get these sorted if need be (i need somebody to explain to me about it first! )

heres a thought, for the finals ill use one of your 'fast' cars and in return you can race primrose (except craig coz hes too close for comfort ) you may then see why i, and others thought a seperate series was a good idea. yes i agree, quite a few good valid points have been made which i and others didnt consider but this was the point of the thread im new to all this and most of you have done it for years so forgive me if the idea was shite.

cheers
richie

Haha did we not tell you Richie when you come on here you got to leave opinions at the door

No seriously tho as you said its and idea and get some feedback thats all, i mean i am not being critical, far from it, just from my point of view pionting out where i can see practicality issues with it? I am sure an idea is where ACE came from to give Paul, Daz and Glynn (i may be wrong there mind dont quote me) a chance to race in there own class and a good one it was too!

Its good people come up with ideas and it keeps things going and people enthusiastic richie and in fairness in a bigger class i think could possibly work well. Personally i like the racing classes they have in the states like super street, super gas/comp etc where you run heads up but to an index like 9.90/10.90/11.90 etc and would love to have a shot at it as its almost heads up but still capped but in reality there is far too few cars in this country probably to ever run it realistically.

For me a good weekends racing, a few beers and a bit of a laugh does it every time but for me the more cars that turn up the better so i agree with attracting more cars as it means more rounds, a bit more to go at and a bigger party to all add to the fun wether i get to the final or go out first round it leaves a bit more to watch!

As we know people come and go and as long as there is more come to ACE than go from it i am sure we will keep having a good laugh and fun weekends racing.

For me the fun aspect is just as important as any of it but i cant see why as a series that means it cant progress past 8 of us racing on a sunday without loosing the fun!

Keep em coming Richie!

I think your spot on nige......absolutely nothing wrong with what we have......But i do think we could do with a few more competing......not a lot mind.....and i think people are just trying to think of ways to get em involved.

I think its about keeping what we have and at the same time trying to let other people know WHAT WE HAVE at york.....a great set of people...good laugh... and not taking things too seriously.

Correct me if I'm wrong but are we not the only
AIRCOOLED ONLY BRACKET RACING SERIES IN THE UK
I think that's something to promote

cheers

craig